Kastle

"The deal is just that nobody goes after her, okay? Not on my watch."

- Frank to David about Karen.

Kastle is the het ship between Frank Castle and Karen Page from the Daredevil fandom.

Daredevil Season Two
Karen is still working at Nelson & Murdock, when Grotto, a man who survived a massacre, comes to them and begs them to save him. A man called the Punisher, is after him. When Grotto is brought to the hospital by Karen and her associates, the Punisher attacks. The man dies, and Karen, distraught, begins investigating the mysterious assassin. She learns his true identity and real name, Frank Castle, once a husband and father who was hospitalized with a bullet in his head. She finds truth about him having been a marine, and how he was on the verge of death having been tortured. She breaks into his home to find more information, where she finds a picture of his family and learns that Frank’s entire family had been murdered. Having finding out the truth, Karen dedicates herself to proving to the public that Frank Castle is more than just the Punisher. Whereas everyone saw Frank as a terrorist or a merciless killer, Karen was the only one who cared deeply enough to find his home; and willingly engage in the humanity that was taken away from him. She later visits Mitchell Ellison at the New York Bulletin, and tells him that she found the Bulletin's article on Frank to be incomplete. Citing the omission of any mention of his family and his impressive military record.

Frank is captured and awaits trial (and possible death sentence), when he is visited by Karen, Murdock, and Nelson. When they meet face to face and Frank refuses to cooperate, Karen rushes at Frank, showing him the photo she had taken from his home. She angrily tells him that someone was trying to cover up his family's murder, and that the three of them were the only ones who cared. Frank was suprised to hear she'd been in his home, and when Karen reveals to him what she knows about his past, she earns his trust. In midst of Nelson's questioning, Frank requests that he wants Karen to stay with him alone. Karen stays with him; and after talking about what really happened to his family, the two become at ease with each other. Frank assures her that she was never in any danger when he was trying to assasinate Grotto, and if he wanted her dead, she wouldn't be here right now. After Nelson and Murdock agree to part ways, Karen continues her personal investigation on Castle. She finds another victim in his case, in addition to Frank’s family. In the meantime, Castle escapes prison. When Karen is attacked, Castle saves her, which she openly admits to Murdock. Karen believes that the Blacksmith is targeting her, so she needs to leave. Murdock tells her that he's going with her, but she tells him that she is not his to protect. Later she meets with Frank in the parking lot. She is uneasy because they are lying to the police, but she trusts Frank enough to leave with him nonetheless.

Frank takes Karen to a diner, where they discuss how they might find the Blacksmith. Changing the subject, he compliments her on her choice of gun, and says he's surprised she didn't shoot him. The two laugh and continue talking, before Castle asks her about Murdock, guessing that she was in love with him. Karen stammers and says that she felt many things about Murdock— and that it was a swirl of emotions, but it wasn't love. When she argues that Murdock hurts people, Frank tells her that he would give anything to have his wife hurt him again. Karen soon finds out that by coming here, Frank had used her as live bait. He then tells her to get the waitress and cook, and hide. Frank gets attacked by the Blacksmith's men, but he easily fights them off. Karen sees Frank beating information out one of the men, and then killing them all. Karen looks, repulsed.

Castle later locates a man who he thought was the Blacksmith, however he finds out by Daredevil that the man had lied. When the man speaks into a walkie-talkie and calls reinforcements, Castle pushes Daredevil off the ship and waits for the men to show. When the Blacksmith's men show up and open fire on Castle, it isn't long before the ship blows up. Karen shows up with the NYPD and looks at the burning ship with tears in her eyes.

When police believe that Castle is dead, Page reluctantly agrees; rather than dropping her investigation into Castle, which she was going to write an exposé on for the New York Bulletin, Page decides to write a profile to show the public that there was more to Castle than just the Punisher. She interviews Castle's marine commander but realizes that he is the Blacksmith. The Colonel holds Page at gunpoint and forces her to drive somewhere secluded to kill her, however Castle arrives and saves Page. After, he prepares to murder him despite Karen’s pleas.

In the final episode of Daredevil, Karen watches in shock as Frank helps Daredevil defeat two of The Hand's men before dissapearing.

The Punisher
The two are reunited again, when Frank asks Karen to help him find the man stalking him. Karen invites him to her apartment, but he doesn't stay long. When he is about to leave, Karen tears up and grabs him, drawing Frank into a tight hug. They both seem to be extremely relieved and comforted by the embrace. Afterwards Karen seems embarassed as she drops her gaze and runs her fingers though her hair (one of her nervous tics).

Later they meet by the docks and Karen says she found the man Frank is looking for. She is anxious about disclosing the man's identity as she fears Frank might want to kill him. Castle promises that if Micro proves to be no threat to him, then he will not kill him. Before Frank leaves, Karen asks when they will meet again; he is surprised she wants to see him again. Karen says she cares about what happens to Castle, even if he doesn't care about himself. She tells him to be careful. Some time later, they meet by the bridge. Karen tries to convince Castle to allow either her or Madani to expose the criminals he is hunting, but Frank refuses to let that happen. Frank begs her not to put herself in grave danger as he does not want Karen to become a target like his family. He kisses her on the cheek and leaves.

When Karen arrives at the Royal Hospitality hotel, they get under a terrorist attack. When things go awry, Lewis, the terrorist, captures Karen and tries to escape, shielding himself with her. Looking at Lewis with barely restrained rage, Frank reassures Karen that he would come for her. He later persues them and tries to talk him down. Frank gives Karen a signal and she disarms the bomb and shoots Lewis in the foot. When the bomb is rewired, Lewis sets it off, and Karen and Frank get hit by the blast. When Frank comes to, he checks Karen. The forces are waiting behind the door, convienced that it was Frank who set off the bomb, and Karen lets herself be used as a human shield to get him escape to an elevator. Inside, they catch their breath and Karen reaches out to him. Before Frank escapes through the zip-line, he and Karen share a silent moment, pressing their foreheads against each other and saying goodbye.

Moments

 * In Daredevil Season 2 Episode 12, Karen stays all day at the docks to see a sign of Frank.
 * In Daredevil Season 2, after Karen tells Frank she'd been in his old house, he asks for her to stay.
 * Karen always defended Frank against anyone who thought he was just a merciless killer.
 * Frank kisses Karen on the cheek in The Punisher and tells her he can't let anything happen to her.
 * In The Punisher, David referred to Karen as Frank's girlfriend.

Quotes
"You, stay. Please."

- Frank to Karen in the hospital. "You're still all heart, huh?"

- Frank to Karen.

"... Good luck, Frank."

- Karen to Frank.

"I think he was looking out for me."

- Karen about Frank.

"All of them, they all think you're a monster. But I know that you're not. You're not!"

- Karen to Frank.

"Karen... hey. I cannot let that happen to you, you got that? I can't let that happen. Please."

- Frank to Karen about her getting hurt.

"Are you okay?"

- Frank after he saves Karen.

"Listen to me. Listen. I’m only gonna say this once. So is Karen."

- Frank to David after he says that Sara is his wife and family.

"If anything happens to her I..."

- Frank to David. "I will come for you."

- Frank to Karen after she gets taken hostage.

Behind The Scenes
"The big difference for me is that with Frank, I can be more honest about who I am, in my past, even if I don’t show specifics."

- Deborah Ann Woll about how Karen feels about Frank.

"I think a lot of the connection with Frank was that if he's a monster, then so am I.. because I did the same thing. Now, I did it once, maybe twice. I think that connection was that I, on a deeper level, can understand his pain and the instinct. I maybe wouldn't follow through in the same way Frank does, but he can't fully be a monster to me."

- Deborah Ann Woll about Karen's connection to Frank.

"I think part of what makes Karen and Frank so special, is they’ve allowed each other deeper. So that every time we see them with other characters, you go, ‘Oh, but they’re not showing their whole self,’ and that’s why it’s such a breath of fresh air when they come together, because there’s much more of a revelation."

- Deborah Ann Woll.

"I think if anything, it’s easier for Karen to sympathize with Frank than it is with Matt in some ways, because Karen in a lot of ways is more like Frank… I think the relationship growth for Karen and Matt will be ‘How can they really open up and show their true self to each other?’ And in a way, I think she’s already there with Frank. I mean, Karen’s a vigilante more akin to Frank in many ways than to Matt, who has his religiousness and his righteousness that is sort of pulling him in many directions. I think in some ways, Karen can’t be really honest about who she is with Matt in a way that she can be with Frank."

- Deborah about Karen, Frank and Matt. "I think it’s ‘cause they’re more alike than either of them first realized. She has killed, even if it was in self-defense, and she protects the people that she cares about. That’s something that she’s done and can relate to in him. If he’s a monster, what does that make her? One of my favorite qualities of Karen is that she’s all about the common ground. She’s about, how can we understand each other and relate to each other? She’s not interested in absolutes. She’s interested in the grey area, in between, and the complexity of issues, not the simplicity of them. There have been great lines about how the truth isn’t necessarily better, but at least it’s real. She’s interested in understanding more than condemning, and I think that’s why she’s able to see through Frank. And I think Frank looks at her and sees that, but he can also see that she’s more complex. He doesn’t put her on a pedestal, the way that Matt and Foggy did. To Matt and Foggy, she’s just the light, and she may want that. She maybe doesn’t want them to see the darker side to her, but Frank sees it, recognizes it and, most importantly, accepts it."

- Deborah Ann Woll about Frank and Karen. "I wish there could have been more of Karen and those two [Frank and Karen] together. If there’s one person in this world that I think that has the fortitude to handle anything Frank’s got to give, and vice versa — I mean, they’ve both been to some dark and ugly places, but it’s nothing either one of them can’t handle, and they truly accept each other for who they are. I think if there’s one person he could really connect with, it would be her. And that she could sort of get him out of it, if there is any getting out of it. But you have to pay homage, at the end of the day, to the source material, and to me, the Frank Castle that’s always resonated with me from the comics is the guy who’s not looking for any light. He’s not looking for any light or happiness or peace, he’s accepted this world of darkness and he feels like he’s got a purpose, and that’s what keeps him on mission. That’s what keeps him sane."

- Jon Bernthal. "After months in hiding, Frank resurfaces to again seeks out Karen on The Punisher, as she's one of the few people who knows he survived the explosion in Daredevil Season 2. His stated reason is that he needs help finding information about this Micro who has tracked him down, but it's obvious he requires more: a human connection; family. His Marine buddy Curtis Hoyle can give him advice, and lend him books, but Franks longs for something more. Not romance, necessarily, just ... more. He knows Karen, probably better than Matt Murdock and Foggy Nelson do. He knows she still carries "that hand cannon" in her purse (knowledge that becomes crucial later in the season), but that she's also softhearted enough to stop and give a "homeless" person some money. However, Karen knows Frank, too, enough to realize she cares more about his well-being than he does. She also understands that for Frank Castle there can't be a happy ending, and it tears her up inside. But Frank and Karen aren't alone, not entirely. They have each other, a notion that's as problematic as it is comforting. Karen's proximity to Frank places her in as much danger as anything she might right for the Bulletin. He rebuffs her offer to help expose the people who killed his family, saying, "Look, I ... I can't go after these men and keep you safe. I can't do both at once. [...] What do you mean, I don't have to keep you safe? My famiy's gone because of what I know -- they're gone! ... Hey, come on, I cannot let that happen to you, you got that? I cannot let that happen. Please." There again, Frank conflates Karen with his family, because in his mind, that's precisely what she is. It's not that he views her as some kind of surrogate for his late wife Maria, who still both haunts him and brings a smile to his face. No, Karen is perhaps the only person with whom he can display tenderness, and honest-to-goodness human emotion. She embraces him -- a bit too long, she realizes -- in their initial reunion, and he chastely kisses her on the cheek in Episode 5. It's the danger posed to Karen, and not to some liberal senator or the good people of New York City, that later pulls Frank from his mission to stop Lewis Wolcott, the troubled young veteran who becomes fixated on overthrowing a government that, in his view, refuses to protect its citizens' Second Amendment rights. Lewis sees in Karen a possible ally -- after all, she was sympathetic to The Punisher -- but when she publicly ridicules him for killing innocent people by setting off a series of bombs in Manhattan, she and an anti-gun senator become his targets. In one of the strongest episodes of the season, the Rashomon-like "Virtue of Viciousness," Frank risks public exposure, arrest and death to save Karen, who's interviewing the senator in a hotel suite guarded by Anvil, the private military company owned by Billy Russo (Ben Barnes), the ex-Marine believed by Frank to be his best friend. It's an episode that not only makes the public aware that The Punisher is still alive, but finally reveals to Frank the involvement of Billy in the conspiracy. But the events of Episode 10, the last time we see the two of them together in the season, also demonstrates the strength of Karen, and of her bond with Frank."

- CBR about Frank and Karen. "In Episode 11, Karen rushes to Frank’s bedside hearing about his hospitalization and pending murder charges to check on him and offer legal assistance. He admits to killing three women, which is against his moral code, and advises Karen to walk away because she cannot fix this situation. But, Karen insists that his actions would never change how she feels about him, which makes him scoff as he replies that it should make a difference. Karen stays by his side, sympathizing with him as he tearfully reveals details from his continuing nightmares about Maria and the kids’ deaths. He connects that pain with his guilt over killing the women while Karen gently holds his hand. And, if you listen close enough, you can hear the audible sighs from Karen/Frank shippers who are feeling all the feels."

- Bustle about Kastle. "I love, love, love working with Jon [Bernthal]. I think what we found with Frank and Karen is really unique, obviously has never been done in the comics, so it really belongs to us in the Netflix world."

- Deborah Ann Woll. "And, of course, we have Daredevil star Deborah Ann Woll reprising her role of New York Bulletin reporter Karen Page for a handful of episodes. Karen factors into the best episode of the season -- a time-shifting narrative taking place solely inside a single location -- and she also gives Frank a chance to be emotional without rage taking over, which is actually needed from time to time."

- Nick Venable on Karen and Frank. "Yeah, I mean, I think that Frank has a soft spot in Karen's heart. And certainly with the dark history that Karen has there's very few people she can share her true, authentic self with. And certainly Matt with his Catholicism and not wanting to kill anybody and things like that- would have trouble understanding some of the... decisions that Karen has made. And I think Frank is someone who could understand, who she could potentially fully open up to. So yeah, I think she's always excited to come back into Frank's arena."

- Deborah about Karen, Matt and Frank. "When Castle rejects both Nelson and Murdock—the actual lawyers—and chooses to speak to Karen about the case, this is why. It’s not because she’s the woman, or because he wants to apologize for terrifying her with a shooting spree; it’s because she alone was willing to go to his house and engage with the humanity that was taken away from him. Castle is willing to spill his family’s tragedy to Daredevil because he’s half-dead and the cops are on the way—it’s entirely possible that this will be his last chance to tell his story. Here the show is telling us something sad, explaining pain through a monologue. But Karen’s silent tour of Castle’s home is the show trusting us to experience that pain. We’re expected to allow Castle’s loss to enter our own minds without the mediation of an actor monologuing. This is the scene that gives us the real weight of Castle’s loss, and shows us why he became the Punisher. By structuring this arc in this way, the audience is allowed to connect the dots as Frank speaks. We can see him sitting in his daughter’s room, refusing to read her book. We can see that this space has become sacred in his mind, and so we jolt when we realize, along with him, that Karen has been there. Matt attempts to become the Punisher’s Father Confessor; Fisk treats him like an attack dog he can unleash; Foggy begins and ends openly terrified of him. Karen, on the other hand? She defends him to Matt, rejecting all of his good Catholic attempts to push her into agreeing with him, and remain the sweet girl she is in his mind—she even allows this argument to ruin their second date. She’s the one who talks Frank through the arguments Matt and Foggy make on his behalf, to make sure he understands. She insists that he has a moral code—and that’s after he pursued her through a hospital like The Terminator. She’s the one he comes to after his escape from prison, and she’s the only one who wouldn’t shoot on sight when he turns up at her door. He even listens to her when she tries to talk him out of killing."

- Tor about Kastle. "And then there is Castle’s charged, intimate dynamic with Karen, which has progressed from a surprising bond in Daredevil to a slow-burn romance for the ages here."

- Emma Dibdin. "I think Frank can tell. When Karen shot Wesley in Season 1 of Daredevil, there was a mention of some stuff that happened before she got to New York, and we don’t really know exactly what her deep dark past is. I like to say that Karen wears a disguise as much as Daredevil and Punisher do. The pretty blonde smiling girl is just a way of saying, 'Hey, don't look too deep, because you might not like what you find,' and I think Frank is capable of seeing past that. Karen certainly looks at him and says, 'Well, he takes justice into his own hands. I did that at least once, so I can’t just call him a monster.' She's a little more open to understanding him instead of writing him off."

- Deborah about Frank and Karen. "And I love that she [Karen] chooses him [Frank]."

- Deborah Ann Woll.

"When I found out, I was so glad 'cause I really love the relationship between Frank and Karen, and I'm certainly not done telling that story yet, not even after The Punisher Season 1. There's still more that I'd like to dig into. Any opportunity that I get to strengthen those stories is a good thing."

- Deborah Woll. "What’s great about the character of Karen, and what’s so beautiful about the way that Deborah Ann plays her, is that she cracked me [Frank] open and she gets in there. She’s relentless, and she’s strong. For Frank, he really looked at that character as, he swore to himself no one would ever affect him again. He would never have any emotion except for loss, and anger, and rage, and pain. Here’s this character, all of a sudden, that he’s talking to and that’s opening him up...Deborah Ann, she’s such a joy to work with, and a wonderfully, wonderfully talented, smart actress."

- Jon Bernthal. "There’s a bit at the end of the series where the two of them are just alone in an elevator together and they’re looking at each other and we didn’t know what it was gonna be, we didn’t know what was gonna happen, we didn’t know what it was gonna mean, but it definitely means something."

- Jon Bernthal about Karen and Frank's last scene. "...If you were to describe their relationship, I could only describe it sort of in gestures and feelings."

- Jon Bernthal on Frank and Karen. "Karen is a character that he very much cares for. Whether he wants to or not. And I think he’s the kind of guy who views that as a weakness. But, you know, the heart is a tricky thing. And when your heart’s affected, your heart’s affected."

- Jon Bernthal on Karen's effect on Frank. "And for Frank and Karen, even though it ends with them going their separate ways and having made their choices, he did say that he loves Karen, and she was able to say that back. It felt great to do that."

- Deborah Ann confirming Kastle. "One of the first things I did when I knew that was the direction they were going was, I reread "Silence of the Lambs," because for me, that felt very similar to this. In a way, he is a mentor for her, even though he may do things that she doesn't agree with, or he does them in a way that she finds to be too violent, or unjust, or illegal. He still represents someone who is trying to make a difference, who is doing it his own way. So the relationship can be one of admiration, and distaste. It's a very interesting, complex relationship."

- Deborah Ann Woll on Frank and Karen's mentor/student relationship. "Karen isn’t seen any more after helping with Frank’s escape plan, so it can be assumed that she will continue working for Matt Murdock and try to move on with her life. It’s a heartbreaking blow for fans who hoped they would fall in love, but a happily ever after ending just wouldn’t fit a character like Frank Castle."

- BUSTLE on the finale of The Punisher. "We talked a lot about it being a fight for Frank's soul, and that if he's someone that she loves to some extent, we can't even entertain the idea of being together or being there for one another unless he comes back from the dark side. So I think it's a moment to ask him: hey, you're gonna have to pick. Is it going to be this vendetta, or is going to be life? Presumably, maybe, life with me, and then when he says no, it's just doubly devastating."

- Deborah Ann Woll on Frank's choice.

Fanon
Kastle is one of the most popular ships in the Daredevil and Punisher universe. It is the second most popular ship for Karen, and the second most popular for Frank. Kastle is popularly shipped alongside ClaireDevil and MattLektra. It's rival ships are Fratt and KareDevil.

Kastle has a big Fandom on Tumblr, Twitter and AO3. On AO3 Kastle is the most popular ship written for both Karen and Frank. It is the third most popular ship written in the Daredevil (TV) tag, and the number one most written ship in The Punisher (TV 2017) tag. Many fans have been saddened by the surprise cancellation of the show, and believe that Karen and Frank could have had future together as a couple, had the show been renewed. Kastle fans were also saddened by Frank and Karen's hospital scene, when Frank rejects Karen's offer to love something else instead of another war, saying "I don't want to."

There is also controversy surrounding Kastle. Some fans think that Karen and Frank should not be romantically involved and should just stick together as friends. Deborah Ann Woll also commented saying that while she and Jon Bernthal would like to explore the possibility of them being romantically involved, she thinks that as a woman, not every relationship with a man has to be romantic.

"Jon and I certainly feel that there's room within that story to go there. But I also think as a woman, not every relationship with a man in the story has to be romantic. Frank’s whole plot line is about avenging the murders of his wife and children, who he loved desperately, and until he comes to some closure with that, I don't know that Karen can really step on those toes. I do think that there's affection and longing between them, and just how that manifests, we'll just have to see."

- Deborah Ann Woll.

Fans who don't ship Kastle, also interpret their relationship as to somewhat of a brother/sister dynamic rather than a romantic one. Steve Lightfoot, the Punisher showrunner commented:

"What I love about that relationship is that, across the three seasons of shows that it’s appeared in now, we’ve never defined it. Some people see romance there, and some people see a brother and sister dynamic between them. I love that we still have the possibility to go wherever we like with that, in the future."

- Steve Lightfoot on Frank and Karen's relationship.

Through the official Punisher twitter, some fans have begun to view Kastle as more of a friendship or a father/daughter bond. This was due to the confirmation that Frank thought of Karen as "family" when a Kastle fan responded to the official Punisher twitter with "Kiss! Kiss! Kiss!" about Frank and Karen, the response was:

"Not gonna happen, pal. She's family."

- Punisher.

Deborah Ann Woll also said that the relationship between Frank and Karen is like a mentor/student relationship, a la The Silence Of The Lambs.

"Woll referred to their connection as more of a mentor-student relationship, a la The Silence of the Lambs."

- Bustle on Kastle.

There is no other controversy or hate surrounding Kastle, besides some fans saying that they have a "large age gap" however that is incorrect. With Frank being in his late 30's, Deborah Ann Woll debunked this controversy and confirmed that they do not since Karen is 33.

Fandom
FAN FICTION

TUMBLR

TWITTER

SPOTIFY
 * Kastle Playlists on Spotify

8TRACKS

Kastle on 8TRACKS

Trivia

 * Frank Castle and Karen Page don't interact in the original Marvel comics.
 * There is a Fan Forum made for Kastle by the Punisher and Daredevil fans. The fan forum also features an appreciation thread for Kastle.
 * Jon Bernthal's favorite Kastle quote is Frank's "I will come for you."
 * Kastle was 9th on the most popular ships list on Fandometrics.
 * The official Punisher twitter responded "Red can't protect Karen." when a KareDevil fan asked Karen if she remembered Matt. Punisher later posted a gif of Karen and Frank with the caption "Nothing happens to her on his watch." to which Deborah Ann Woll quote retweeted, "Awww.."
 * Deborah Ann Woll liked multiple Kastle fan arts on Twitter.
 * In the Punisher Season 1 episode 2, Frank gives Karen white roses. White roses are viewed as a way to symbolize a new beginning and have come to represent love.
 * Frank shields Karen from bullets in The Punisher.
 * Deborah Ann Woll and Jon Bernthal are both Kastle shippers; and have expressed their support for Karen and Frank's romantic relationship on numerous occasions.
 * Deborah used the #Kastle tag on Twitter. She also retweeted Kastle fan art and called it beautiful.
 * Jon quote retweeted a post with him and Deborah during an interview from a Kastle fan account with the caption, "Miss. You. Prosecutor."
 * Deborah asked her audience on Instagram of what they think happens to Karen and Frank in their fan fiction.
 * Deborah said during an interview that while they are hyping up Season 3 of Daredevil, she wants everyone to not forget that she did a whole season with Frank Castle and she wants to keep that alive.